• Hi, I am the only currently active Bureaucrat on the OwO Bot Wiki, a wiki which was created to document the OwO game on Discord. There are a couple of other Administrators on our wiki team, and other wiki staff as well, and we have a small active editor community that is growing daily. Some of our wiki staff (not including myself) are also part of the staff team of the OwO game itself.

    I would like some advice please from a FANDOM and general wiki perspective. I'm walking a bit of a tightrope between trying to maintain the open and democratic freedoms expected within a wiki community, while at the same time abiding by the expectations and policies being imposed by the game dev staff. Our wiki is currently a truly "for the fans, by the fans" unofficial wiki, but there is the potential for it to become officially sanctioned by the game dev staff. In the meantime, there are certain obligations that the wiki needs to meet if it is to be promoted in any official communications channels of the game, such as in the official Discord server of the game.

    What I would like to know, is how I should best go about adhering to the expectations and policies of the game dev staff, while not inadvertently breaching any FANDOM rules about openness of the wiki to all editors? As an example, a situation has arisen which concerns the appointment of new staff on the wiki, which the game dev staff want veto rights on. How should I best handle such a situation?

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    • Hello to any FANDOM staff and representatives who read this. I'm one of the administrators of the OwO Bot Wiki and a staff member of the OwO Bot Discord server. I'd like to provide my input and opinion on this matter.
      I love the openness to edits from any player of the OwO Bot and I have nothing against the ability for anyone to make productive and corrective edits and additions to the OwO Bot Wiki, however when it comes to promoting staff members, I personally stand by my statement that it should take a discussion and research into the wiki member as a bot player and Discord member. Within the OBS server, moderation is done through the Dyno bot, which logs warnings and mutes for members who do not abide by the rules. I understand that Wiki staff will be separate in many ways from the Discord server, however with our hope that the OwO Bot Wiki will be official to the bot someday, I feel that it is necessary to take into account the fact that the staff here should be members that are not problematic in regards to following rules and being overall respectful of others.

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    • If you want to talk to staff, Special:Contact is the place to go.

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    • The link Tupka gave is good.

      A thought I have is: Somethings are FACTS while other things are "opinions."

      For example, the stats and dates of Babe Ruth's baseball career are established facts. They cannot be changed, and if anyone tries to exercise the motto of "anyone can edit" by altering details, you'd be right to revert them.

      Now, anyone can express their opinions about the Babe's career. For example, "I think his homerun on [date] should not be counted because [opinion]." Well, that's fine but has no place on his FACTS sections or pages.

      Another example, I love the idea of Kim Possible living an "alternative lifestyle" despite what canon says about her. However, none of that matters and has no place on the Kim Possible Wiki. So I cannot express that outside of blogs and talk pages. BUT on the Kim Possible Fanon wiki, I can explore it to my heart's content because fanon is not canon….

      See? If the Game Devs say "X is X", that's a fact, and if a user wishes to say otherwise, you can revert it back to FACT. (Although, be nice too to provide a place for them to discuss opinions in a reasonable way.)

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    • Hey Tupka, I'm not sure why, whenever I mention the word "staff" around here, you always seem to think I'm talking about FANDOM staff only. You made a similar comment in this thread of mine a while ago, about a different wiki I was working on at the time. There are many levels of "staff", not just the official FANDOM staff. We have the volunteer staff of our wiki, and the authorized staff of the game developer for the fandom that our wiki relates to, for instance.

      Thanks also for the reply, Love Robin. I agree that the game developer and their staff are the keepers and defenders of the FACTS about the game that our wiki is about, and I truly respect and value the help that any game dev staff lends to the wiki in that respect, for their knowledge of the game itself is second to none. What I am concerned about is the potential for "office politics" within the developer's scope to at some point cause our wiki to violate FANDOM standard policy about openness and democratic freedoms for all editors.

      As a wild and completely fabricated example with no basis in truth at all, what would happen if the game developer's staff ever made a ruling that nobody can edit the OwO Bot Wiki unless they are registered members of the OwO Bot Support server on Discord first? Surely if that were to ever happen, it would violate some FANDOM rule, wouldn't it?

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    • Staff, as a term and title, refers to Fandom staff. It's sometimes used by wikis to describe their admin/mod team, which can lead to confusion. The anon aimed his reply specifically at Fandom staff, so I gave a link to a place where they could better reach Fandom staff.

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    • I aimed my response at the fandom staff to introduce myself as an admin, however my comment was in response to what Trisquel Whare was saying. This is why I mentioned the OwO wiki and bot throughout my message, and I can't tell if my message was fully read before the response was given. Also I was and am only on anonymous due to forgetting to sign in.

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    • Sorry Tupka, before we proceed with the discussion at hand about the need for maintaining independence and respecting individual freedoms of all editors on the wiki, whilst at the same time respecting the wishes of the game developer's staff, shall we digress for a moment onto the issue of "staff", which seems to be your intention here?

      I note that you are listed as one of the FANDOM "Councilors", no doubt meaning that you are a member of the FANDOM "staff" team. Congratulations, that's very cool. However, I don't see how other groups, such as individual wikis within the FANDOM stable, having their own "staff", or the game developer of the fandom which is represented by the individual wiki as having their own "staff" can, as you say "lead to confusion". Nobody in this discussion as yet seems to be confused on this matter at all. From what I understand, FANDOM does not have a trademark on the use of the term "staff",do they? Is there some official policy or statement from FANDOM that you can point me to which prohibits the use of the term by anyone else? No? Cool, then can we please get back to the subject at hand now? Thanks.

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    • I'm not Staff. I'm a Councilor. I gave the link to contact Staff because the anon addressed Staff. No need to digress further.

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    • Hello, now I'm actually signed in properly.
      To cut things to shorter terms, what Trisquel and I are inquiring about has little to do with Fandom staff members and is instead in regards to deciding on the moderators and other staff members of the OwO Bot Wiki and whether or not limiting staff members for the OwO Bot Wiki based on prior information on their behavior outside of the Wiki is acceptable.
      As I'd stated before, my standing is that "it should take a discussion and research into the wiki member as a bot player and Discord member....... I feel that it is necessary to take into account the fact that the staff here should be members [of the OwO Bot Support server and the bot itself] that are not problematic in regards to following rules and being overall respectful of others."

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    • To address that issue: a wiki is free to choose their own admins. Some have formal nominations and votes, others draw from friends, or mods from other social media groups on the topic. You can set membership of another group as a prerequisite.

      As long as you don’t place such restrictions on editing, you can do what you feel is best for the wiki. As for the wild example, you can tell the OwO staff that Fandom currently has no mechanics in place to achieve that in a practical manner, and they need to adjust their expectations.

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    • You can also choose to restrict editing to logged in users. You can’t really set a rule that usernames on the two platforms have to match because MediaWiki doesn’t allow for quick or per-wiki changes to usernames. You can ask people to please add their Discord to their masthead to create some sort of link between the two.

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    • Thank you for clearing this up for us. We wanted to make sure we had an official response before continuing with our processes. I hope you have a pleasant day.

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    • Thanks for the replies Tupka. I guess my own past experience of the WikiMedia projects have coloured my expectations, and I had assumed that the process you mentioned, of "formal nominations and votes" would be the norm here on FANDOM wikis too. Good to know that things are more flexible here on FANDOM, and we can accommodate the expectations of the game developer's staff without violating any FANDOM rules in this matter.

      Thanks also for your perseverance and further explanation from the OBS staff perspective, Elsa. I think we can put this issue to rest now.

      Merry Christmas to everyone!

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    • Mine is not an “official response” in any way. For official responses you have to use that contact link I gave you. However, don’t expect a reply soon with the Christmas holidays. Most Staff are out of office intil the next decade.

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    • To help clarify the "staff" issue…

      If on your wiki (OWO?) where you use "staff" to mean one of the administration (Mod+) of your wiki a user comes along and starts talking about "staff" but they mean someone on another wiki, I trust you can see where the confusion can happen. *You* think they're talking about one of your people when they're not, so you ask them to ensure proper use of terms.

      On *this* wiki, Community Central, any casual use of "staff"/"Staff" is understood by the longer/experienced users to mean FANDOM Staff (and here I personally like to use Cap-S to clarify). Their masthead tags read Staff (indeed, should be the same across ALL (English language) wikis), and there is a special tag to their signatures. Any Usage of the word will catch the attention of any actual Staff casually looking over the feeds. And it catches our eyes too, those of us who are small-s "staff" (admin levels) on Central.

      It's mainly boils down to a form of "situational awareness"; a word/term/phrase on one wiki may have different meaning(s) on other wiks.

      I hope that helps cut through any confusion.

      Welcome to Central!

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    • A FANDOM user
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