Forum:MediaWiki 1.12 upgrade

It's upgrade time again! We have started moving all wikis to MediaWiki 1.12, starting with some inactive wikis and ending with the largest and most active.

If you notice any strangeness on a wiki, please check Special:Version to see what version of the wiki software is being used. If it's 1.12, then please report any problems here. Many thanks! -- sannse (talk) 22:38, 14 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Mind a link to a place with 1.12 installed, or install it on CommunityTest so we could play arround?
 * I'll start a page at Forum:MediaWiki 1.12 upgrade new features and add in what I can before I half to go to work. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 14, 2007 @ 23:01 (UTC)


 * 1.12 is on scratchpad right now. -PanSola 05:10, 15 December 2007 (UTC)


 * It's also on the 1000 most inactive wikis, such as the Ajax wiki. I've put a list of those here in an old revision Angela (talk) 05:16, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Update: 1.12 is now running on all wikis other than wowwiki.com, gamewikis.org, halo, callofduty, tabularasa, massefect, memory-alpha.org, marveldatabase.com, dcdatabaseproject.com, kennisnet, ffxiclopedia.org, starwars, yugioh, eq2, uncyclopedia.org, nonsensopedia, nonciclopedia, dofus, runescape, muppet, finalfantasy, inciclopedia, transformers, desencyclopedie, and evchk. These final upgrades will happen after Christmas. Angela (talk) 11:57, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
 * since yesterday Dofus got upgrated to 1.12alpha --Cizagna (Talk) 14:18, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Problems with special pages

 * (2034) Regexblock might be faulty. GHe is blocked (only GHE ought to be blocked). Angela (talk) 05:16, 15 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Double redirects is showing some redirects that should be listed in broken redirects. w:c:particracy:special:doubleredirects is an example - Communism is an external redirect to wikipedia, which used to show in broken (internal redirects such as rieke's talk page are still listed in broken). -- Manticore   (talk)  13:19, 24 December 2007 (UTC)


 * This really isn't a problem with a special page, but more of a change in how we should do things. Basically, remove Special:GiveRollback and Special:MakeSysop, and in its stead add $wgAddGroups['bureaucrat'] = array( 'bureaucrat', 'sysop', 'rollback' ); and $wgRemoveGroups['bureaucrat'] = array( 'rollback' ); This would allow bureaucrats to use a limited version of the Special:Userrights interface instead of the idiotic method of various special pages that we have now (you do not need to give bureaucrats the 'userrights' permission in order for addgroups and removegroups to work). -- 03:05, 31 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Special:Giverollback is no longer functioning. Error message given is: "There is no user by the name "X". Check your spelling." Angela has confirmed this is not working on any 1.12 wiki (but is still working on 1.10 wikis). -- Manticore   (talk)  08:24, 7 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Special:Activeusers and Special:Listusers have apparently been merged, with a link at the top to show/hide the blocked ones.  So far so good.  But on doom:Special:Specialpages, both links lead to the same list, and when hovering over the links, the tool tip and status bar still indicate two different page titles.  (What MediaWiki: string goes at the top of that page anyway?  I think a description might help new editors with previous experience elsewhere.)    Ryan W 04:52, 12 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment links on Special:ProblemReports are still red even after comments have been added.   Ryan W 03:30, 16 January 2008 (UTC)


 * On doom:Special:Protectedpages, most of the protected pages are missing (for example Entryway and Talk:PLAYPAL).   Ryan W 03:41, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
 * This is an existing problem, and isn't related to the 1.12 upgrade. If I recall correctly, it has something to do with pages protected in earlier versions of MW. -- Manticore   (talk)  03:44, 16 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Special:Unusedtemplates includes redirects, unlike similar pages such as Special:Lonelypages.   Ryan W 08:15, 16 January 2008 (UTC)


 * w:c:Dofus:Special:Log/upload overwrite does not says what has been overwrite one must enter users contributions to be able to know what has been overwrite --Cizagna (Talk) 20:16, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Problems with extensions

 * Special:MiniUpload. When a file is uploaded using the http://images.wikia.com/common/skins/common/images/button_upload.gif button, in the preview ("Size your Image") a js file is missing: The file is a HTTP 404 - Not Found error. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 10:22, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
 * This file seems to control the "insert this image" button, because clicking on it does nothing, and the name of the file isn't displayed anywhere, so there's no easy way for users to find the files they have uploaded --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 10:27, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Also is missing --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 15:58, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
 * In the normal Special:Upload if uploading a file gives a Warning (the file is more than 164KB or already exists) you can select "upload again" or "return to upload page". But this extension acts like the image was uploaded but it's not uploaded any more, because it doesn't handle the warning. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 16:21, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
 * The problem with image inserting is still reproduced Raindrop 09:01, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I find really stupid that this bug hasn't been solved yet. Only 2 files need to be placed on the server filesystem (for the first part of the bug). More than one month ago since it was reported. It's really weird. The rest of the bugs are following the same way. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 13:16, 26 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Special:MultipleUpload is broken. When uploading files it says that the file(s) uploaded is(are) empty, while uploading with Special:Upload works. In addition, the form is replicated (when try to upload and gives the warning) as many times as the number of files uploaded. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 10:46, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Problem reports - I can now see all wikis problem reports on wikis with 1.12, which is great. However, I can't close any problem reports on those wikis I have +sysop on that are running 1.12. -- Manticore   (talk)  12:20, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I can now close reports, but the log entry is "(marked problem as "Object")" instead of "fixed" etc. -- Manticore   (talk)  07:17, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Other problems
Pywikipediabot doesn't function properly. A simple text replacement does not work on Scratchpad or Community Test, which are both running MW1.12a, but it does work on Medical Biography, which is still at 1.10a. This is most likely something to do with Wikia's configuration, because Wikipedia (which is also running 1.12a) doesn't have the same problem. -- Manticore   (talk)  11:17, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't think it's an issue only with the mw12a upgrade. Pywikipedia has been broken for me for some time on Wikia because of how much the skin has been skewed with. And the Animepedia is still mw1.10a. O_o wait... It's working now... How can it be working now! T_T... retraction... somehow they fixed the bug that was giving me crappy errors about charsets being converted. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 18, 2007 @ 17:41 (UTC)
 * make sure you log your bot account in on a browser and set ITS skin pref to monobook. --Uberfuzzy 18:33, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
 * The problem here is that the bot adds automatically credits for Wikia and the wiki itself, because they are added in the XML dumps (for example using Special:Export and Special:Import you can see it) --@ Chixpy 05:05, 9 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Apparent duplication of JS quickinsert buttons (E.g. Insert bold, underline, link, signature, etc. (above the editing textarea; not part of MediaWiki:Edittools)). GHe (Talk) 20:54, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Uncyclopedia: We have double edit tools. User Hape42 made a screenshot → Screenshot. Greetings Tomsen (talk) 20:42, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Wikis with MW1.12 have two edit toolbars beside eachother.--Richard 03:44, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Solved now --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 19:22, 21 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Overall, general slowness on 1.12a. GHe (Talk) 20:57, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Seems to be up to speed now. GHe (Talk) 21:32, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Not really --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 15:47, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Problem solved --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 19:22, 21 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Observed at sw1ki... Using the monobook skin, the footer div isn't being properly placed on the page. See also: Forum:Format Problem. -- Xerxes 20:46, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I can second this; one of our users reported a floating footer on IE6. --GreenReaper(talk) 04:45, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
 * There appears to be a problem with some of the wikis and their formatting. Examples may be found at the Earthen Ring Wiki and The Vault, where the bottom Wikia banner is displaying at the bottom of the browser window upon initial loading instead of the page, itself. Also, while it is possible to call up the page for logging in as a user, one cannot click on the text fields to add their username and password. This problem began at some time between approximately 7:30AM EST and 8:30AM EST. --Lilithia 16:29, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I dont know if this has to do with the mediawiki upgrade, but it is a problem. On my kya dark lineage wiki] there is a box that says "About Wikia Terms of use Advertise Wikia® is a registered service mark of Wikia, Inc. All rights reserved" its in the middle of all the articles, it should be on the bottom like it used to but its not, i cannot even edit some of the pages becuase its blockng the edit button,it is even on the articles itself and blocks some text, the kya dark lineage wiki is not the only wiki its effecting, i have also seen that its happening to the ratchet and clank wiki as well Ratchet and clank wiki.If someone can fix this it would be great-hotspot
 * Seems solved now --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 20:22, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * In monobook skin the right border is missing (near advertising). Maybe it's not a new problem, but today I saw. :) Here this border exists. --Pixi 23:12, 20 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I've noticed large amounts of lag on Zelda Wiki, though it's probably just form the upgrade. Also, nice job on upgrading the wikis! I've been looking forward to MW1.12 for some time and am very glad with Wikia for doing this!--Richard 00:10, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Possibly related: Sometimes when I save an edit to a category page or an image description page, it displays the old version (as though it's the current version). Reloading always updates it though.    Ryan W 02:07, 19 January 2008 (UTC)


 * I no longer see the RSS and Atom feed links on the Special:Recentchanges page. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 21, 2007 @ 04:12 (UTC)


 * Widget preferences (which ones are on, and their positions) aren't being loaded with 1.12 wikis. They all use the default widget setting. -PanSola 05:57, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Various filters (E.g. spam filters and external image filters) need to be made compatible with MW 1.12a if not done so already. GHe (Talk) 06:32, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Special:Editcount thing for showing overall edits to all wikis is broken for example User:Cometstyles/Edits shows 0 and so does User:Manticore's userpage and User:Vagstar's page and I think it might have reseted.....-- Cometstyles 20:37, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Don't know if it's just my PC but on my wikia the 'Search' and 'Create An Article' Input boxes have their buttons messed up.-- Monnite wars  06:56, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
 * That's because are missing MediaWiki:tryexact c:localnews:MediaWiki:tryexact and MediaWiki:searchfulltext c:localnews:MediaWiki:searchfulltext messages --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 10:35, 25 December 2007 (UTC)


 * New messages diff fails if the user adds a redirect to another page and its immpossible to see the diff as it always redirects :-( --Markie 18:38, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Could you please give a link to an example where this happens? --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 19:15, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
 * See search:user talk:Markie-search where i created a redirect from a second account to my main account. obv i cant give you a link of the diff as it appears for me :-)

Please, read carefully before adding in a note about the toolbar duplication; it's already there 3 times. — TulipVorlax 10:12, 27 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Newsbox messages aren't displaying on 1.12a wikis -- 19:23, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
 * When the talk page modified is in a MW1.12? Because I had a message posted on my talk page on central wikia (MW1.10) some days ago and the notification was shown on es.pokemon, which was upgraded 2 weeks ago. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 18:38, 30 December 2007 (UTC)


 * When using Special:ImportFreeImages, we are now prompted to enter a destination filename (which is very good). However, the image source and license information is no longer added to the page. Please fix this quickly, because we are violating the Creative Commons license by omitting this data. Spankart 12:35, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * In Quartz skin my wikia has got link "Start new article" on top of page. When clicked leads to Special:Createpage. That page does not exist, and shows error "No such special page". Link from what I remember is deflault to all wikias. SkywalkerPL 19:31, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Image overwrites do not identify the image in question. GHe (Talk) 03:36, 6 January 2008 (UTC)


 * The inaccessible article bug has returned.  Even worse, it now searches all wiki titles!  (See list of novels here.)    Ryan W 12:21, 15 January 2008 (UTC)


 * When editing a MediaWiki message string for the first time, the default text sometimes fails to appear in the edit window.   Ryan W 09:39, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Discussion and solved problems

 * The link to Statistics on the Special:Statistics page actually links to Statistics because of the interwiki link. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 15, 2007 @ 09:50 (UTC)
 * That was related to an edit in the mediawiki namespace, not to the upgrade and should now be fixed. Angela (talk) 09:53, 15 December 2007 (UTC)


 * (2033) Special:Contributions gives an error saying Set $wgShowExceptionDetails = true; at the bottom of LocalSettings.php to show detailed debugging information.. Angela (talk) 05:16, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Should be fixed now. Angela (talk) 06:00, 17 December 2007 (UTC)


 * (2052) Errors on Special:Export (example) (via Jack)
 * Fixed as of version 7859.


 * (2044) Inputbox needs to be upgraded. (via Jack Phoenix)
 * MediaWiki:Createarticle now exists, so is this still a problem? Reasons to not upgrade this are that the new version no longer supports &action=create and &action=prefix, which could break some existing links if wikis were using these options. Angela (talk) 05:35, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd suppose that's ok - article creation via Inputbox is something that definitely should work at all times, so let's not break Inputbox. :-) --Jack Phoenix (Contact) 20:08, 18 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I have reports from the NetHack wiki (http://nethack.wikia.com/) that a GFDL template is displaying in the wrong places on the Main Page. There's problem #4838 and a comment on the talk page to the main page. I don't see it either in Firefox or Explorer. Does anyone have any information on this?--Ray Chason 01:29, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * In there is the following code:  . This makes the MiniUpload button (the http://images.wikia.com/common/skins/common/images/button_upload.gif button) to point to /index.php/Special:MiniUpload and it points to the main page. wgScript should be wgScriptPath --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 21:02, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Fixed now. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 19:02, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * From MediaWiki 1.12/new features: Nonexistant pages can now be protected. So a Title Blacklist using Cascade protection is no longer needed to prevent page creation of a bad page.. Where can we access to that feature? action=protect in nonexistant pages fails, and I couldn't find any special page for that :( --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 15:04, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
 * That's listed in the RELEASE-NOTES for MW 1.12. I hunted it down and it was added in rev 28385 of MediaWiki. Is Wikia using a revision older than that? ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 25, 2007 @ 04:08 (UTC)
 * Yup, Wikia has r26409, so that feature is not included because it was added in r28385. (This is why I prefer to only update to a quarterly release instead of an alpha) ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 25, 2007 @ 06:49 (UTC)


 * Nowadays, the JavaScript files are loaded in the following order (at least with MonoBook):
 * /wikibits.js
 * gen=js (Common.js, Skinname.js and user-generated.js)
 * User:skinname.js
 * User:global.js
 * MediaWiki:Global.js
 * allinone.js
 * This should be changed so userJS could override coreJS, skinJS, and wikiJS in this order:
 * /wikibits.js
 * allinone.js
 * MediaWiki:Global.js
 * gen=js (Common.js, Skinname.js and user-generated.js)
 * User:global.js
 * User:skinname.js
 * Are there plans to change this order? If scripts were loaded in this order, we could fix some bugs like the duplicate toolbar buttons or MiniUpload issues, but we can't because allinone.js overrides all the actions we could do --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 15:04, 24 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I know that my templates are a bit large, but as you can see at Anime:Project:Sandbox4 some of my infoboxes are not displaying. Don't hit me for the complex template, but that's not the problem I'm referring to. There was a important parser upgrade made in MediaWiki 1.12, it's supposed to make inclusion of templates and use of ParserFunctions less intensive on the server, in addition it's supposed to remove the pre-expand include size limit because there is "no efficient way to calculate such a figure, and it would now be meaningless for performance anyway", however the comment I'm getting in the HTML output about this template, is that the pre-expand include size is to large. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 25, 2007 @ 06:49 (UTC)
 * Just checked it out this was added in r27667, and Wikia only has r26409. Our list of benefits is being severely reduced. Now that I see that two of the major improvements in MediaWiki in MW1.12 are not included in the revision that Wikia has, I'm seriously doubting that this update is really necessary. Especially since it's slowing down Wikia and we're missing the update that improves performance significantly. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) (tricks) (current topic) Dec 25, 2007 @ 06:54 (UTC)
 * Maybe it would have been better to upgrade to a stable MW1.11 release instead of an unstable 1.12 alpha. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 10:09, 25 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Site-specific Google Analytics statistics are no longer being collected. There used to be code to run through an array of wiki ID/Analytics ID pairs and run the custom ones with that - now it just has the Wikia one in there. --GreenReaper(talk) 15:43, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Appears solved as of Sunday night. --GreenReaper(talk) 23:45, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

Slowness, pictures showing as links and no edit buttons
I don't know if this has anything to do with the upgrade but I think it might, on my wiki  all the pictures that I didn't upload myself have reverted to links AND the edit buttons have all myteriously disappeared so I can't edit anything AND it's really slow. So if someone could help?


 * Yes, we've been working on this thru the weekend. The 1.12 upgrade is running "hotter" on our apaches than 1.10a and we're working to figure this out. The image issue is also due to the 1.12 upgrade and we will hopefully have a fix for that shortly. Johnq (talk) 01:53, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Solved now --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 19:22, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I have problem with picture showing as link. See it here: w:c:homeworld:User:SkywalkerPL/test. It's PNG, and.... all I get is link, when should be red dot (1x1 px). :( SkywalkerPL 18:09, 27 January 2008 (UTC)
 * That's because externally hosted images were disabled. If you want a site be whitelisted for hotlinking, then ask for it to a staff --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 18:24, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Not sure if the change-over is complete on marveldatabase, but we're experiencing these same problems. The Special:Version page says we're up to 1.12a, and we have no edit buttons, and non-existant images showing up as non-linked words, rather than a blank image inside of the tags. I'm assuming this is a work-in-progress/still-in-changeover type situation, but in case anyone was unaware of these problems, I'm including them here. Thanks. --Your Friendly Neighborhood Peteparker (talk &bull; contribs &bull; email) 19:43, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Editing Problems since 1.12
I have no idea where else to report this, but the Codex of Editable Wisdom has problems since the upgrade.

In the edit window, all the buttons above the text field appear twice! Also in the mini-upload for pictures, I can't edit the thumbnail before inserting it, since the buttons for scaling, heading and the choice for it not being a thumb are broken. And the insert button is defunct, too, so that while the picture is uploaded, I have to insert it manually.

Hopefully you guys can fix it.

--Tribun 12:58, 29 December 2007 (UTC)


 * We all know about these problems. They're reported avobe. Please, read the avobe problems before posting --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 15:36, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

Did the upgrade break Common.js? Because I don't think anything in my Common.js works any more. -- LordTBT Talk! 06:29, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

I don't want to appear impatient, but after almost a MONTH I thought you guys would have fixed this error by now. What's the big problem that drags it for so long? --Tribun 12:29, 16 January 2008 (UTC)


 * I did a patch that ensures that there's only 1 toolbar, and also removes the MiniUpload link (because it doesn't work properly), knowing that the techs are too lazy to look into it. So if you want, feel free to put it in your Common.js or where you want. I told about it to Angela to put the patch on Global.js on central, but nobody moves a finger for that. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 19:10, 16 January 2008 (UTC)


 * The double toolbar/js mess is now solved --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 19:22, 21 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Oh! Is it why the toolbar doesn't appear at all now on fr.guildwars ?
 * In fact, i don't have it on central neither.
 * But, i dont know because all pages just seems to take eternity to finish loading... — TulipVorlax 04:45, 27 January 2008 (UTC)


 * The "normal" toolbar appears for me on central, and also on fr.guildwars (at least as anon user). But it's true that sometimes it took very long for it to load. The entire page is loaded but still appears a "transfer from images.wikia.com" and the toolbar (and other site scripts) doesn't load for a while. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 10:40, 27 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah, new users on fr.guildwars are asking "is it normal that it's slow or is it temporary?". I said that the slowness of Wikia supposed to be temporary but it return often. — TulipVorlax 07:20, 3 February 2008 (UTC)


 * I've noticed MW 1.12 to run more slowly than its predecessors on non-Wikia sites as well. For instance, the list of Uncyclopedias on uncyclopedia.info's main page seemed to take anywhere from several seconds to half a minute to regenerate after that wiki was updated to a more recent 1.12 version. Like most of the most severely-affected pages, it makes heavy use of templates, extensions and parser functions. This would be true for the main page for various high-traffic sites. At least one very busy wiki (desciclopedia.pt) went back to MW 1.11 as the newer version was too slow to meet the needs of the community.
 * So no, this isn't just a Wikia-specific issue. Odd that Wikipedia hasn't noted any issues about this, given the speed penalty we seem to be paying for the upgrade. --carlb 23:00, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

SVG rendering broken fixed
SVG-rendering is completly broken. You can see that when uploading new SVG images and when creating thumbnails of existing .svg Images. --Matthias 17:58, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Has been fixed. Thank you --Matthias 16:29, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Default signatures
Since the upgrade, seems like the signatures of the users are not linked by default, as if the  ckeckbox in Special:Preferences is checked by default, so users that haven't modified it's signature have a plain sig, without a link to their subpage, making hard to access to their talk pages. Could it be unchecked for new users by default? --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) -WikiDex 18:21, 8 February 2008 (UTC)